'Marry Me a Little' explores effect of legalized gay marriage on a cartoonist's relationship

INTERVIEWER: Here's a question for you. How does marriage define a relationship? St. Paul-based cartoonist Rob Kirby wrestles with this question in a new graphic memoir, Marry Me a Little, about his experience marrying his longtime partner John. The two got hitched back in 2013 just after gay marriage was legalized in the state of Minnesota.

Rob is best known for his comic strip, Curbside which ran in dozens of LGBTQ and alternative papers in the US and Canada from 1991 to 2008. His new book is out today. We get to celebrate together. Hey, Rob. Welcome to the program.

ROB KIRBY: Hey. Thanks for having me.

INTERVIEWER: I'm so pleased you could be with us. It might be kind of tough for some younger folks to imagine, but there was a time when gay marriage was a really contentious political issue. The vast majority of folks support it nowadays.

Talk about what was it like to live in the environment, especially prior to 2013. Politicians would fight about this issue in debate. It got really contentious. How do things feel different now 10 years later?

ROB KIRBY: Well, yeah. I mean, back then marriage rights, to be honest, I wasn't really on my radar that much. It simply-- I think it's my fatalistic streak talking. I just didn't think it was really going to happen, even though it was slowly brewing.

And when it suddenly began to happen state by state, with Minnesota in 2013 being number 12, which we were very proud of. And then nationally, just a couple of years later being legal throughout the country, it was a whirlwind and a huge cultural shift. And I am very happy that younger people-- for younger people now it seems like a given. I mean, we'll see what happens in the future. But for now things seem fairly secure I think.

INTERVIEWER: How has your relationship and the idea of a successful marriage evolved over the years?

ROB KIRBY: Well, I mean I think I talk about it-- in the end of the book, I kind of sum up that it's a collection of little things and big things and arguments and quirks and private jokes and doubts and commitments and work and play and joy and grief. That sums up to me what a relationship is. It's an accumulation of so many things-- emotions and occurrences and events-- both in your purview and without.

And I hadn't prewritten any of that when I wrote that part of the book in early-- or in the winter of 2022. I was wrapping up the book, but I was just trying to distill it all into something simple, something easily imparted. And that's what I came up with. And to me personally, for John and I, we've made it through. And that's something to celebrate, and that's marriage license or no marriage license.

INTERVIEWER: I like the way you describe it. And then you have a phrase at the end of the book too-- "Day-to-day life stacking up into years gone by." That's really beautiful. And it does make you really reflect that, what marriage can be.

You also write you've been called unromantic. But you know what? I mean, writing a memoir about your love for someone feels really quite romantic. Why did you want to put yourself and your partner on the stage that a memoir creates?

ROB KIRBY: Well, I think I wrote about my experience through a personal lens because that's how I roll as an artist, a cartoonist. And I think a dry, historical account could definitely work. But I think any story is more interesting and more relatable when you personalize it. And I was writing more from a sense of ambivalence towards marriage at the outset, rather than a starry-eyed sort of romanticism.

But I think my attitude in the book progresses from that ambivalence to a kind of wholehearted acceptance, especially when I was standing in the lobby of the Government Center with a few near and dear ones around us pledging my vows. I mean, I got really caught up in the moment.

INTERVIEWER: Marry Me a Little, of course, is also the title of a charming and bittersweet musical revue that features songs by Stephen Sondheim. I'm sure you know about it-- two singles share a Saturday night of very sweet fantasies about relationships, and they never leave their solitary apartments. So how does-- did you did you deliberately want to use that title, given it's a Sondheim musical?

ROB KIRBY: Yeah. I mean, it was just that-- because it's such a rich song. It has so much emotion. And what else-- again, my ambivalence and John's ambivalence about marriage, we just weren't really sure it was something we really needed to do. It just summed it up best, and I just borrowed it. Thank you, Stephen Sondheim, for writing that amazing thing. And I hope that's cool that I borrowed your title.

[LAUGHTER]

I think it just said it all, didn't it? Yeah. [LAUGHS]

INTERVIEWER: One of the challenges in writing a memoir is succumbing to doubt. Is my personal story interesting enough to hook readers? Did that pop up for you?

ROB KIRBY: No. Because I think that this-- and my experience has borne this out. Marriage and weddings are there-- things that people have deep feelings about and ambivalences about. And everyone has a story. If you're not married, you've been to a wedding, or you have loved ones that have gotten married. It is an endless source of fascination.

And that's why I even put in some stuff about marriage from movies. Because in movies and popular culture, it is heightened. There's drama inherent in a wedding. And they just, of course, play that up for farce or drama. And yet, in real life, it's mostly a lot of quotidian, boring events. Setting up-- picking the wine it's not exactly a dramatic thing, but I tried to make it humorous.

INTERVIEWER: Or the flavor of the cake, that kind of thing. So what do you remember about your day, your wedding, looking back?

ROB KIRBY: I remember-- [LAUGHS] I remember-- again, when I was standing in the courthouse with Judge Cutter, and we were giving our vows, that's when I was-- that's when I fully gave over to it. Yes, this is great. And it was very surreal. It was very floaty through the whole thing.

And then afterwards, having this wonderful dinner at Restaurant Alma in Minneapolis, our favorite restaurant, and with more people joining us. It was just-- it was a wonderful day, and it's a very special. And it was a really nice way to ritualize our relationship-- cement it.

Even though-- I will say, again, wedding-- the wedding was great and all that. But our relationship was solid anyway. This just kind of like was kind of a public affirmation of it-- a performance maybe, if you will.

[LAUGHTER]

INTERVIEWER: Perhaps. It was a lovely book, Rob. Well done. Thank you so much.

ROB KIRBY: Oh, thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

INTERVIEWER: Rob Kirby is a St. Paul-based cartoonist and the author of several books, including Marry Me a Little. He'll have a book reading, signing, and interview at Magers and Quinn Booksellers, 7:00 PM March the 16th. You can register on the Magers and Quinn website.