Minnesota hospitals put the heat on lawmakers to back away from health care package
A nurse at a Mayo Clinic medical ICU at St. Mary's Hospital rests their hand on the edge of a patient's bed in Rochester, Minn.
Evan Frost | MPR News 2020
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Minnesota hospitals and the Mayo Clinic are pressuring lawmakers to back away from two proposals in both the House and Senate versions of a health care package.
One provision would create a Health Care Affordability Board that would make recommendations to address rising costs. Another would give nurses more say in hospital staffing levels.
Lawmakers still need to resolve differences in the two bills before sending them, as part of an overall health care spending package, to Gov. Tim Walz's desk to be signed. With these negotiations in their final stages, lobbying is heating up.
Most notably, Mayo Clinic recently threatened to pull billions of dollars of investments from the state if lawmakers don't back off. Rochester Post Bulletin business reporter Jeff Kiger has been following all of this and he joined MPR News host Cathy Wurzer to talk about it.
Use the audio player above to listen to the full conversation.
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Audio transcript
[MUSIC PLAYING] CATHY WURZER: Minnesota hospitals and the Mayo Clinic are pressuring lawmakers to back away from two proposals in both the House and Senate versions of a health care package. One provision would create a health care affordability board that would make recommendations to address rising costs, and another would give nurses more say in hospital staffing levels.
Lawmakers still need to resolve differences in the two bills before sending them as part of an overhaul health care spending package to Governor Tim Walz's desk to be signed. With these negotiations in their final stages, lobbying is heating up. Most notably, Mayo Clinic recently threatened to pull billions of dollars of Investments from the state if lawmakers don't back off.
Rochester Post Bulletin business reporter Jeff Kiger has been following all of this, and he is on the line. Hey, Jeff. Thanks for joining us.
JEFF KIGER: Thank you. How is it going, Cathy?
CATHY WURZER: So far so good, so far so good. Hey, last week, as you know, in a message to lawmakers, Mayo says it was considering taking its infrastructure plans to other states. Mayo has locations in Scottsdale, Arizona, and Jacksonville, Florida. What are the Investments Mayo is talking about here?
JEFF KIGER: That's a great question. They aren't giving a lot of specifics about that. But they are talking-- there's been lots of discussion about facilities being planned, possibly in Rochester, but they aren't saying exactly what.
CATHY WURZER: OK, now this isn't the first time Mayo has used its Investments as kind of a negotiating chip. I'm remembering it was, I think, it was 2013, it said it would take the Destination Medical Center elsewhere if lawmakers didn't contribute money to the project.
And of course, that project is still in Rochester, right? Any lessons to draw from that situation back in 2013?
JEFF KIGER: Well, that situation was, I think, a little different. But overall, Mayo did get their way. They got a lot of pushback for making that statement, and they did walk it back some. But it did turn out the way they wanted it in the end.
They have used similar tactics in regard to the provider tax, Minnesota provider tax for hospitals, and that still exists, so they haven't been successful all the time with these.
CATHY WURZER: Say, what specifically is Mayo asking lawmakers to change in these bills?
JEFF KIGER: Well, I think primarily with the Nurses at Bedside Act, they're talking about Mayo facilities to be excluded from that or have an exemption. And then the board, health care affordability board one, they're basically saying
[AUDIO OUT]
made here gone. There's not a lot of-- it doesn't seem like they're looking to have that one adjusted. They just don't want to see it happen.
CATHY WURZER: The Minnesota Hospital Association has weighed in. They issued a statement. They have an op-ed piece in the Strib. How is the Minnesota Hospital Association's stance maybe a little bit different from Mayo's? Do you know?
JEFF KIGER: It's not very different. I went through their statements. They've got some very strong wording in there, what this could mean for non-profit hospitals in Minnesota overall. But obviously, Mayo
[AUDIO OUT]
So they're kind of following along the same line of thought, anyway. So it's pretty similar, but it is very strongly worded.
CATHY WURZER: Now, I just read your piece in the Post Bulletin today about the Rochester business community looking at this. What do they say? What do business people say?
JEFF KIGER: Well, people, business people in Rochester, are always very-- they watch Mayo Clinic very closely. And much of their success depends on Mayo Clinic's success. So they really wanted to-- they want Mayo to get what they want. They
[AUDIO OUT]
businesses. The old statement down here is, or kind of joke, is that if Mayo Clinic gets a cold, the Rochester economy gets pneumonia. So we're very closely tied.
CATHY WURZER: Now, the nurses association says, they're calling Mayo's pressure really tantamount to blackmail. And I'm wondering if you've had a chance to look at what they're talking about.
JEFF KIGER: You mean-- well, I mean, I think it is fair. Blackmail, obviously, is very loaded, but it's fair to say this is an ultimatum. They're putting a lot on the line here.
So Mayo is saying very definitively and more publicly, more clearly than we've ever seen before, that if they don't get their way, it could cost literally cost the state and probably Rochester
[AUDIO OUT]
CATHY WURZER: Hmm, sounds we may have lost Jeff there for just a moment. Jeff? Are you back with me there? There you are. Sorry, you just kind of blipped out a little bit. That's OK.
JEFF KIGER: Sorry.
CATHY WURZER: It's all right. You were just talking about the nurses. Continue, if you could.
[AUDIO OUT]
JEFF KIGER: I think that that-- we're seeing this is a much more-- Mayo has often, has long been big in lobbying at the state legislature. But we've never seen this kind of come out as blatantly and publicly, I think, as this discussion has happened about this type of issue.
CATHY WURZER: By the way, what does Mayo-- have you had a chance to talk to anybody from Mayo about this at all?
JEFF KIGER: Some. They put out some-- their statements have been pretty general, as they often are. They have not-- the one thing I've been looking at
[AUDIO OUT]
specifics about this $4.4 billion or possibly $4 billion investment and what that actually breaks down to, whether that would be-- how much of that would be in Rochester or elsewhere in the state. We aren't getting much detail on that at all. But they're just saying they feel this is important, and that's pretty much the only statement they're giving to us.
CATHY WURZER: I think the Mayo board's meeting this week. So there's not a whole lot of time here in terms of a negotiating stance on these issues and what lawmakers are doing. Say, before you go, Governor Walz says there could be a way to compromise. And I don't know if you've had a chance to talk to your folks down there about what a compromise might look like.
JEFF KIGER: Well, I think the exemption in the nurses issue, that bill, that would probably be the big one, the big compromise that's possible. I do believe that there is some talks trying to get something hammered out, some sort of compromise here. I don't know what the compromise with the affordability board would look like, but I do think they're trying for something.
CATHY WURZER: All right. Jeff Kiger, I know you're busy. Thank you so much,
JEFF KIGER: Sure.
CATHY WURZER: Jeff is a business reporter and a columnist for the Rochester Post Bulletin.
Lawmakers still need to resolve differences in the two bills before sending them as part of an overhaul health care spending package to Governor Tim Walz's desk to be signed. With these negotiations in their final stages, lobbying is heating up. Most notably, Mayo Clinic recently threatened to pull billions of dollars of Investments from the state if lawmakers don't back off.
Rochester Post Bulletin business reporter Jeff Kiger has been following all of this, and he is on the line. Hey, Jeff. Thanks for joining us.
JEFF KIGER: Thank you. How is it going, Cathy?
CATHY WURZER: So far so good, so far so good. Hey, last week, as you know, in a message to lawmakers, Mayo says it was considering taking its infrastructure plans to other states. Mayo has locations in Scottsdale, Arizona, and Jacksonville, Florida. What are the Investments Mayo is talking about here?
JEFF KIGER: That's a great question. They aren't giving a lot of specifics about that. But they are talking-- there's been lots of discussion about facilities being planned, possibly in Rochester, but they aren't saying exactly what.
CATHY WURZER: OK, now this isn't the first time Mayo has used its Investments as kind of a negotiating chip. I'm remembering it was, I think, it was 2013, it said it would take the Destination Medical Center elsewhere if lawmakers didn't contribute money to the project.
And of course, that project is still in Rochester, right? Any lessons to draw from that situation back in 2013?
JEFF KIGER: Well, that situation was, I think, a little different. But overall, Mayo did get their way. They got a lot of pushback for making that statement, and they did walk it back some. But it did turn out the way they wanted it in the end.
They have used similar tactics in regard to the provider tax, Minnesota provider tax for hospitals, and that still exists, so they haven't been successful all the time with these.
CATHY WURZER: Say, what specifically is Mayo asking lawmakers to change in these bills?
JEFF KIGER: Well, I think primarily with the Nurses at Bedside Act, they're talking about Mayo facilities to be excluded from that or have an exemption. And then the board, health care affordability board one, they're basically saying
[AUDIO OUT]
made here gone. There's not a lot of-- it doesn't seem like they're looking to have that one adjusted. They just don't want to see it happen.
CATHY WURZER: The Minnesota Hospital Association has weighed in. They issued a statement. They have an op-ed piece in the Strib. How is the Minnesota Hospital Association's stance maybe a little bit different from Mayo's? Do you know?
JEFF KIGER: It's not very different. I went through their statements. They've got some very strong wording in there, what this could mean for non-profit hospitals in Minnesota overall. But obviously, Mayo
[AUDIO OUT]
So they're kind of following along the same line of thought, anyway. So it's pretty similar, but it is very strongly worded.
CATHY WURZER: Now, I just read your piece in the Post Bulletin today about the Rochester business community looking at this. What do they say? What do business people say?
JEFF KIGER: Well, people, business people in Rochester, are always very-- they watch Mayo Clinic very closely. And much of their success depends on Mayo Clinic's success. So they really wanted to-- they want Mayo to get what they want. They
[AUDIO OUT]
businesses. The old statement down here is, or kind of joke, is that if Mayo Clinic gets a cold, the Rochester economy gets pneumonia. So we're very closely tied.
CATHY WURZER: Now, the nurses association says, they're calling Mayo's pressure really tantamount to blackmail. And I'm wondering if you've had a chance to look at what they're talking about.
JEFF KIGER: You mean-- well, I mean, I think it is fair. Blackmail, obviously, is very loaded, but it's fair to say this is an ultimatum. They're putting a lot on the line here.
So Mayo is saying very definitively and more publicly, more clearly than we've ever seen before, that if they don't get their way, it could cost literally cost the state and probably Rochester
[AUDIO OUT]
CATHY WURZER: Hmm, sounds we may have lost Jeff there for just a moment. Jeff? Are you back with me there? There you are. Sorry, you just kind of blipped out a little bit. That's OK.
JEFF KIGER: Sorry.
CATHY WURZER: It's all right. You were just talking about the nurses. Continue, if you could.
[AUDIO OUT]
JEFF KIGER: I think that that-- we're seeing this is a much more-- Mayo has often, has long been big in lobbying at the state legislature. But we've never seen this kind of come out as blatantly and publicly, I think, as this discussion has happened about this type of issue.
CATHY WURZER: By the way, what does Mayo-- have you had a chance to talk to anybody from Mayo about this at all?
JEFF KIGER: Some. They put out some-- their statements have been pretty general, as they often are. They have not-- the one thing I've been looking at
[AUDIO OUT]
specifics about this $4.4 billion or possibly $4 billion investment and what that actually breaks down to, whether that would be-- how much of that would be in Rochester or elsewhere in the state. We aren't getting much detail on that at all. But they're just saying they feel this is important, and that's pretty much the only statement they're giving to us.
CATHY WURZER: I think the Mayo board's meeting this week. So there's not a whole lot of time here in terms of a negotiating stance on these issues and what lawmakers are doing. Say, before you go, Governor Walz says there could be a way to compromise. And I don't know if you've had a chance to talk to your folks down there about what a compromise might look like.
JEFF KIGER: Well, I think the exemption in the nurses issue, that bill, that would probably be the big one, the big compromise that's possible. I do believe that there is some talks trying to get something hammered out, some sort of compromise here. I don't know what the compromise with the affordability board would look like, but I do think they're trying for something.
CATHY WURZER: All right. Jeff Kiger, I know you're busy. Thank you so much,
JEFF KIGER: Sure.
CATHY WURZER: Jeff is a business reporter and a columnist for the Rochester Post Bulletin.
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