‘The Kamala Harris Project’ has been closely tracking the tenure of the VP

CATHY WURZER: Vice President Kamala Harris is on track to secure the Democratic nomination. According to an Associated Press survey, Harris has the support of well more than 1,976 delegates she'll need to win on a first ballot. If Harris does indeed become the nominee, it would mark a milestone in presidential politics. She would become the first Black woman and first person of South Asian descent to head a major party's presidential ticket. If she were to beat Donald Trump, of course, she would be the first woman to serve as United States president.

Harris is already getting grassroots support from minority voting blocs. 44,000 people attended a Zoom meeting organized by Win With Black Women Sunday night, raising $1 and 1/2 million in just three hours. Joining us right now to provide some context to this historic moment is Duchess Harris. She's a Professor of American Studies at Macalester College and is currently on the project advisory board for the Kamala Harris Project, which is tracking all aspects of Harris's tenure as the nation's first woman of color to serve as vice president.

Professor Harris, it's been a long time since you and I have talked. Thank you, and welcome to the program.

DUCHESS HARRIS: Thank you so much. It's great to be back with you again, Cathy.

CATHY WURZER: Likewise. I'm a bit of an armchair historian and I did a little research before our conversation today. Since 1968, 11 Black women have run for president representing various political parties. One of the first notables, as many folks know, was congresswoman Shirley Chisholm. Kamala Harris ran in 2019 but dropped out. Can you put Harris's presidential run this time around into some kind of historic context for us?

DUCHESS HARRIS: I think something that's important for listeners to understand is that the movement of Black women being involved in electoral politics has been a concentrated effort for the last five decades. And so this has really been intentional when you look in the involvement in the Congressional Black Caucus. This has really been a path.

CATHY WURZER: And I'm curious about the project, the Kamala Harris Project, which I have to say, I had not heard of before because most people don't pay attention to vice president-- a vice president while they're in office. You've been following her closely. What are you-- what have you been learning about her?

DUCHESS HARRIS: Well, I mean, I'm so glad that you mentioned that a lot of people did not know that this project was going on because we started convening in 2021 and we had our first symposium on June 2nd looking at her first 100 days. And it was difficult to get traction at first because there isn't a lot of interest in vice presidential politics. But for those of us who do this for a living, it was important for us to look at what her policies were.

And so to give you a background on this, this group was convened by Ange-Marie Hancock, who is a professor at the Ohio State University. There are 16 researchers involved in this. This is a non-partisan group. And essentially, we are just interested in how she has been functioning in federal government and also how she's been perceived.

CATHY WURZER: And what have you found out? What are some of your-- what are the things that you-- anything surprising that you've learned so far that you've discovered?

DUCHESS HARRIS: Well, one of the things that we discovered is that because this team ended up starting in quarantine, that both she and Biden were not traveling as much as a president and a vice president would be early on, both internationally and domestically. And Biden also was not sure which projects to put her on. And so Harris, surprisingly, has been involved in lots of foreign affairs, but she hasn't had any kind of media attention until the last few days. And so now is a moment where people are starting to pay more attention.

CATHY WURZER: So let me ask you this. Of course, there are so many people across the country that are really excited about what is-- what is transpiring right now. We talked to voters over the weekend. One voter really stuck out to me, and it's a person from Chicago, a woman from Chicago that our Mark Zdechlik talked to. This is Kim Wright. And this is Kim's reaction to Kamala Harris's endorsement.

[AUDIO PLAYBACK]

- He's endorsed Kamala Harris, the vice president, to get the nomination to run against Donald Trump. Is that a good choice? Would that be a good choice for Democrats?

- That I'm not sure of. I'm just not sure that-- I'm not sure that it is. For me as a Black American, I would say yes, and as a woman I would say yes, but I don't think she would have a chance to stand against the Republican nominee.

- Why not?

- Come on. We're in America. America's not ready for a Black American woman president. We're just not.

[END PLAYBACK]

CATHY WURZER: Are you hearing that at all?

DUCHESS HARRIS: Yes, I could hear that.

CATHY WURZER: And what do you think of that?

DUCHESS HARRIS: I am not surprised by that response. And I think one of the reasons why some Black Americans have that response is because of what the community experienced after the election of President Barack Obama. I think that people did not realize how much pushback there would be and how difficult that would be. And so I think some people think that the backlash towards Vice President Harris will be magnified by the fact that she's a woman as well as a person of color.

CATHY WURZER: We were talking this morning to Washington, DC Mayor Muriel Bowser about Kamala Harris. And Mayor Bowser said that Black women in politics have to navigate some stereotypes that can pigeonhole them. Do you think Kamala Harris will also have to deal with that?

DUCHESS HARRIS: I think she already has to deal with that. I think that she is being depicted as a liberal from Oakland. And if you look at her track record as both the attorney general for the State of California, as a United States Senator, and what she's been doing as vice president, she easily could be construed as a centrist Democrat. But I do not think that that is how she's going to be depicted. She's already being depicted as a radical.

CATHY WURZER: And do you expect her background to be weaponized by opponents?

DUCHESS HARRIS: Definitely. I mean, the newest weapon that has happened in the last 48 hours is criticism that she's a stepmom and did not have any children of her own. And so I think the notion of what is an acceptable family is going to be used against her and she is going to be depicted as someone that got married later in life, put her career first, didn't, quote, "make time for children." And is that the kind of country that we want-- the kind of leader we want for the country that we're in? And so there'll be lots of dialogue about that.

CATHY WURZER: So I'm curious, President Biden, as you know, lost ground with voters of color. Do you think that Kamala Harris can win them back?

DUCHESS HARRIS: I think she really can win them back. I even think that Black men who traditionally have not supported Black women as much as Black women have supported Black men, I even think that they will get behind her.

CATHY WURZER: And can you help us out? Why has it been that way, that Black men often do not support Black women in politics? What's behind that? Do you know?

DUCHESS HARRIS: I do know. There is a term in political science called linked fate. And the interesting thing about linked fate is that it helps us understand that Black women are the most loyal voting bloc in the Democratic Party. So 94% of Black women voted for Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. And so the reason why they did that is because they think of their fate being linked by people that they are connected to, such as, possibly their fathers, their husbands, their sons.

So Black women will vote for the greater good. Black men, however, sometimes will vote for themselves. And so you will take a Black woman who will say, is this a politician? Are their policies-- will this be good for my husband? It is rare for Black men to say, are these policies good for my wife?

CATHY WURZER: That was interesting. Then there was that pretty large gathering of Black men for Kamala Harris just the other day.

DUCHESS HARRIS: Exactly. And so that, like, followed the big Zoom call with the 44,000 Black women. And so I am very excited by that. That is unprecedented. And I think that if Black men get behind her, she has a very big stance, big chance of doing well.

CATHY WURZER: Final question is a personal one for you because you are so actively involved in the Kamala Harris Project. How excited are you about what is to unfold here in the next couple of months, a few months?

DUCHESS HARRIS: The question is how excited am I?

CATHY WURZER: Yeah, personally.

DUCHESS HARRIS: I mean, personally, I'm excited just to see how this is going to unfold and to pay attention to her policies. And so this isn't really personally emotional for me. This is more what are her positions going to be and how will that impact the greater good?

CATHY WURZER: All right. Professor, always a pleasure. Thank you so very much for taking the time.

DUCHESS HARRIS: Thank you too.

CATHY WURZER: Duchess Harris is a Professor of American Studies at Macalester College and is currently on the project advisory board for the Kamala Harris Project.